Rumor; Slingshot fired there whole design team??

[rookie]

Herd a rumor that Slingshot fired there whole design team last week, including Doyle?

[BBAddict]

I heard they had some massive lay-offs not that long ago, but laying off their design team would be huge, especially Doyle. Is your source confidential? Was this performance or budgetary firing?!
They just need more Minnesotans to start kiting--this seems to be their market.

You would think there would be some brands falling out given the quantity of kite companies for a relatively small market, but there seems to be a new company every year. The rest of the economy is going the opposite direction, but maybe kiters have all the money.

[Tighe]

wow really you're going to try that one again? This rumor was spread around a year or two ago by another local figure as well. If it's untrue, as it was in the past, that's a pretty lame tactic.

Yeah and I heard they hired Bart Simson as their head designer man, and like the baby from the E-trade ads is gonna do their profile shaping, like for sure....yeah man....

I checked with our in house Rep, and he knows of no such "major layoff". Maybe he isn't aware of it.

If they have in fact restructured they would not be unlike any other business in the world. If they found someone else who could design a better kite or board, of course they'd hire them, and all of us SS riders would benefit. Extremely hard to imagine better designs, yet I've said that year after year, and each year they get better. The current design team has developed more innovations that have been adopted by the industry, than probably any other designer, with the exception of Bruno himself. Hard to imagine they would change that, though again and again the game of business has surprised me.

[BBAddict]

Cool--Bart Simpson rocks a skateboard, so maybe he can design some good boards--not sure about kites though.

I don't think rookie has any reason to start a rumor. I don't know where he heard it, but maybe the truth is good enough without biting sarcasm. I can see why some people are afraid to post here when there are prominent figures that can be so aggressive toward innocent questions.

[steveb]

I think Rookie went fishing and is firing up the barbie.....

[JRN]

DO WE HAVE TO START UP ALL THIS CRAP ALL OVER AGAIN? We have been over this ground before, ad nauseum. I grew up being told," Sticks & stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me." Since when have we become so sensitive, that we can't endure a little sarcasm? As Blain's fellow Brit put it, "If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen." It seems strange to me that when someone actually comes out and expresses some real feelings, others react in such a negative fashion. Is this part of the same thought process that forbids keeping score at a kiddie soccer game, 'cause they're afraid they hurt little Johnny's feelings? Grow up people!

[steveb]

Jim...I'm most disapointed in you...you're being serious.

[Tighe]

sorry my bad. It was the end of the day on Friday after a long week at work. I reacted too quickly. If it was an "innocent question" then my response will be " not that I have heard of"
If it was sarcasm, I'm pretty daft about most sacasm and don't get it.
If it was fishing, I took it hook line and sinker.

Whatever.

[JRN]

The Joke's on me, too. I fell for it, thinking we were in for another round of divisive bashing on the site. The Pranksters pranked a Jokester, too myopic to see it coming. Good Job! Hope I didn't offend anyones' feelings in the process.

[rookie]

Kids,
Slingshot fired the lead board designer; Doyle, and the lead designer for the kites; Wilson. Both have been fired. It’s now a Fact! The stock holders fired the boys so they could finally get a return on there money. So we all know what happens when any company takes away the r & d team. Doyles new adventure will be out in a couple of weeks sshhhh!. , sometimes we need a push, so we can pursue our dreams. Good luck to Slingshot, Doyle, Wilson and Bart!

Jokester ~

[Tighe]

Really? Quite different than what I've heard. I put up a post about Wilson's very honorable change of direction. Didn't appear like he was fired, he just wanted to do other things. Thanks for all great years Wilson. He never was a designer though. Logosz and Amery do most of the designing as far as I know. They get input from all of their riders around the world...who knows maybe some of the views of the local boys get back to them.

John Doyle moving on...hmm...haven't heard that. You sure they didn't mean Mark Doyle, his son? John has been a board designer for them for nearly 10 years. A tenure longer than most in the industry. If he's going a different direction or was fired I'm sure there is a good reason, though I can't imagine it was due to his lake of skills. Slingshot boards have a pretty amazing reputation.

I would think it would be Mark Doyle that may have left the company. Even though his Mom and Father work for SS as well, I could see him wanting or needing to part from that. Because the whole family works for SS I'm sure if one has left for whatever reason, it must be tough.

Thanks for bumping this up again Gary. I think the forum likes a bit of drama and I love talking about Slingshot.

I'll see if I can get some clarification on the Doyle situation.

Funny when I brought this up with our in house rep, he laughed and asked it we were going through a no wind spell.

Who knows maybe you know something I don't. The cool thing is, if you're right, you know they have a better option to fill in, and it will just mean better products in the future. If your infomation is incorrect, then they'll continue to offer great new products every 6 months. Good either way.

New kite coming end of month.
Light wind kite coming later this summer.

[Elkman]

I don't put too much stock in rumours, anyway. They're just second hand news. I suppose people can go their own way, but I don't want to read sweet little lies.

Thanks for the update on the new kites, Tighe. Don't stop thinking about tomorrow.

[jeffwieb]

Did anyone hear that guess jeans are going to have a fifth pocket now? I can't wait!!!! Silly kiters, dramas for kids. Now start thinkin with your dipstick Jimmy

[PaulPaulMan]

Oh... Doyle rules

[ice_kmauve]

I don't see the point in designing a whole new lineup every year. I heard ozone went to a 2 year design cycle, which still seems like too often. The whole world runs on this yearly cycle of redesigns, but do all these costly redesigns help anyone? I doubt it. Mainly, this cycle is about maximizing sales volumes--and because fashion and everything else follows it, so does kiting. But that doesn't mean it's best for kiters. I would rather see fewer new designs and cheaper kites instead. The redesigns are mainly about attracting newcomers with flashy new products, but tell me, does the RPM seriously kick ass over the t2? I doubt it. and even if it does, it'll be next year's "bullet-X" cross-hybrid 4.5 strut 6-line kite everyone MUST have. Despite all this, I have a soft spot in my heart for designers and I hope they remain well-employed; I've benefited greatly from all the R&D that have made kites the reliable wind machines they are.

One annoying thing you can do is divide the price of a kite by the number of sessions you have on, and realize you love an expensive sport. the kite I paid $350 for (thanks Randy) has still cost me around $50 per session. Yes, and they were well worth it. But keep that in mind as they lure you with dreams of higher performance from the same wind, year in and year out.

Keep on truckin' !

[johnz]

Good points, Dave.

Slingy has adopted a 'design it', 'build a bunch', 'sell em', and move on strategy, from what I've been able to tell. Even though they may name their models with the year, they really come out quite staggered. I think it is kind of cool to not reorder old designs and instead tweak or redesign before each batch. Are all the new models needed? no, I don't think so, but their business is to sell kites, so having fresh designs I'm assuming will help. Right now, they have the Fuels for the old school C-kite people, the Octane for those who want a really current, high performance hybrid design, the RPM is somewhere in the middle, and the Ki HD for those who want an affordable, predictable, and really rangy option. It's nice to have a choice, but definitely a luxury.

It is VERY COOL that as the industry has matured, just about any kite that is less than 3 years old is going to be a good and safe bet (as long as it is in good condition) for people - we couldn't say that three years ago

I agree with the $$/session argument - The only way to reduce the cost is to ride more!!!

[Eric P]

I bought my North Vegas in 06, and probably have over 200 sessions on it. It cost me around $900, no bar. I made a bar out of parts form other kites I had bought previously. I would estimate from those numbers that I'm down to under $5 per session on that kite, and it's still going strong. I should really keep better track of my sessions, cus that 200 number is a total estimate. But still, I don't think this sport is all that expensive, as long as you stick to your gear for a while.

My board has at least 200 sessions on it, and it isn't even scratched yet. Thanks Steve B for getting me hooked on a Spleen.

[ice_kmauve]

Eric I recall you getting that kite and I'm glad to hear it has stood the test of time.

Slingshot generally creates high quality gear, in my experience. From the sounds of it, North does as well.

What I am lobbying for is a focus on quality gear, and on the sport itself, rather than on an obsession with brand image that begins to rival that of abercrombie and fitch. I appreciate the fact that selling new kites every year to eager beavers is what provides the funds to actually do the R&D in the first place. I don't have a solution for this, but one idea is, use the ideas you have already spent so much money coming up with in the first place.

I hate when companies ditch the very designs they've sunk so much time and effort into. A good example is the Ford Taurus. They come out with some new idea -- the 500 -- and then next year they bring the Taurus back. Woops.

Back to kites. Slingshot--takes the Turbo series out completely after 3-5 years of building it. And for what? All that moiling around makes the kites more expensive. I'm sure they're planning a re-release of the Turbo after a year off, to build our quivering appetites for it (so we dumb consumers won't get bored).

Come on, quit treating us like spring break babies.

OK I'm done.

[steveb]

Dave , you've not been paying attention. In 2010 compared to the previous year kites came down in price.
Early 2009 you may recall my posted warning to everyone " sticker shock" explaining 2009 kite were going to be expensive because of the huge increase in Teijins pricing. 2010 the prices came back down and all the kite companies reflected that in their pricing.
Kite redesigns are still happening regularly because the kite companies are still learning about their products, I agree that marketing " new and improved" is targetting your dollars, but I still believe the kites are improving every year.
Additionally the style of riding keeps getting pushed and the performance expectations of the kite users are increasing. Surf, wake, freeride, racing all benefit from slight canopy shape variations. Each segment of the sport is becoming more refined and a kite company to make sales in that segment have to have well designed products. So is it the kite users fault by creating market demands or the kite companies fault for expoiting those differences.
Can you get by with one kite and do all, of course you can. However I think most people will agree that there is a design feature they prefer from kites because it suits their riding style. The difficulty to day is making the right choice.
I laugh a little about the quality discussion. Ozone are the only kite company that has the ability to truly influence their product quality, the reason being they are the only company that makes their own kites. I've been working with Ozone since 2006 in all that time I've had one defective kite, a stitching defect, the kite was Pete Kuhns. Ozone tried selling from the quality angle, it didn't work. Some people prefer a different brand, some people prefer cheap and put up with putting more money into their kites after buying them by paying for repairs.
As a predominantly middle aged sport it amazes me that a lot of people buy into the " hype", the shell game etc. when selecting their kites. So when kiters stop buying " new and improved" I'm sure the companies will stop making " new and improved"