Stay connected in the wind. This forum is for anyone who rides the wind, winter or summer, on whatever board suits their fancy. Share the stoke, find out where people are going, ask any question, share your discoveries, and discuss any esoteric idea you may have related to the pursuit of wind. Please keep it positive.
As I was riding, I looked over to the launch to see someone with a
Black/green Yarga launching from the public docks.When I say docks I mean the dock. The kite went up and started for the trees, there was a family straight down wind on the beach. A 5 and 7 year old about 10 feet apart, then the kite crashes very hard, right in the middle of them. From where I was it looked as if someone got hurt bad.
Were not going to have our launches much longer at this rate.
Who ever had that kite, go get some (GOD DAM) lessons.
After I came in and talked to another guy ,he said nobody got hurt, but so close.Luck is going to run out and we are all going to get f_cked.
I posted that overview of the different sites yesterday, I hope to update the lakes pages today.
WACONIA AND WHITE BEAR are intermediate or expert riders only. If you are not experienced do yourself a favor and go to Washington or Mille Lacs. If you cause problems and get these sites shutdown, you will have a very passionate group very pissed at you.
If anyone sees anyone possing any risks to themselves or others, please please please, take it upon yourself to try to remedy the situation, even if that means telling them to pack it up. Tact is very important here. We've all been at the stage that these riders are at. We know the fuel that burns inside to get out and start riding. We as a commmunity have to take it upon ourselves to self police, self regulate, AND welcome others into our sport.
We need to self police ourselves. IF YOU SEE SOMEONG DOING SOMETHING YOU’RE NOT COMFORTABLE, STOP THEM! If you see someone that you don’t recognize at the beach go up and talk to them. Make sure they know what there doing. With all the publicity this sport is getting now there will be more people doing the same thing. If we are at the beach and ignore someone that is doing something stupid we are just as or more responsible because we know it’s dangerous.
Slingshot Kiteboarding/Midwest Mountaineering Regional Team Rider
Skill level is one thing, but being smart is another. I watch kiters at White Bear get far too close to the swimming area, anchored boats, and people outside of the swimming area. Ramsey was very crowded this weekend and there were kiters that were intermediate to advanced in skill level. They insisted on getting within feet of the swimming markers and anchored boats crash landing their kites every other pass. I am suggesting that some kiters feel they need to be so close so they get noticed, maybe even hear some oohs and ahhs and impress the on lookers. The sheriff, lifeguards and beach goers were overheard expressing concern over the encroaching kites. So yeah skill level is important but if you have all the skills in the world but lack commonsence and some restraint, your a accident waiting to happen.
I have to admit I witnessed the Black Green Yarga set up in very sketchy spot (right by the boat ramp, upwind of swimmers and the launches) with what appeared to be a beginner. There was one other guy helping when I saw and I was hoping he was experienced.
Anyway, I was windsurfing and my first concern was self preservation... getting into the beach unharmed by this kite. At that point the kite was still on water and I went back out and didn't see the kite when I returned.
I suppose I should have at least asked if anyone knew the person and at least made sure someone asked his level and what he was doing and definitely suggested he move downwind of the swimmers. There weren't too many other kiters there and I didn't see Sgt Bartell, but it would have been nice if someone (me included) stepped in before the close call.
Anyway, I am assuming the kiter just did not know he was endangering the swimmers and I strongly doubt he's going to read this board, so if anyone knows him or sees him out please suggest moving downwind to launch.
chan rider he does need to move down wind BUt HE SHOULD NOT BE KITING AT WAC. LIKE TIGHE SAID IT IS NOT A BEGGINER SPOT. LAKE WASHINGTON AND MILLACS ARE FOR BEGINERS STRAIT UP!!! NO IFS AN BUTS ABOUT IT.I AM A LOCAL TO THE WEST SIDE AND I RIDE WACONIA AND WASHINGTON. ALONG WITH SEVARAL OTHER LOCALS, AND RIDERS THAT HAVE BEEN AROUND FOR YEARS. LIKE TIGHE SAID U WILL HAVE PEEPS PISSED AT U AND LOOKING AT TERRY POST THERES ALREADY 1 PISSED LOCAL .NOT COOL
"good place to learn in MN (mille lacs) by yourself" .... a GOOD place to learn by yourself doesn't exist.
i agree things need to be added and updated... but perhaps someone wants to volunteer their time also? tighe's got plenty of updates on his to-do list and it seems to just get longer and longer.
i think a good thing to start would be a full page (NOT a part of the forum) that steps someone through getting into the sport. explain how/where to get lessons, who to call, where to go, what not to do, blah blah blah. then put a nice big link on the main page and uptop. i will help out with whatever i can but i'm new to the whole sport so ... anyone wants to write up a quick page and post it to the forum... or part of a page... just something so tighe doesn't need to do it all by himself
Uh sorry? I wasn't aware Wac was off limits to beginning kiters. I don't feel comfortable kiting there so I go other places. However, I'm not sure if I'm out windsurfing the Wac I'm comfortable telling a beginning kiter to pack it up and go somewhere else.
I will let others in the kite community make the call on the Wac. If I see someone doing something really unsafe like a beginner setting up directly upwind of beach users and swimmers then I feel I should suggest moving downwind. If someone else wants to tell 'em to pack up then be my guest.
I woulkd like to just mention something about Millacs from this last Sunday, 20 -25 gusting to 30, awesome day, but anyway I want to admit something that I caught myself doing a few times and that was riding to close to the swimmers at Reddy, I know I knew better but still didn't seem to catch myself until about an hour or two into it? I think about it now and man what an idiot I was, I can't belive that I had done that, I wasn't really dodging in between swimmers but I was too close, it won't happen again. One of the problems with the swimmers that I see, well not really a problem for them but for us kiters is that they go out so far when swimming and it just keeps forcing us to ride farther and farther out? Here's a remedy for that situation I think, and thats to just go down the line from them to the left or to the right and stay down there until you get tired and want to come in, pretty simple huh, until you get caught up in the photographers and all that then you find yourself hanging out close, too close? Am I the only one who feels this way if not, then lets all just agree to kite out a ways or just go off to iether side and kite away from people, because yes one day it will happen. And one more thing if you are a beginner and are out at Reddy or Malmo and there are swimmers please go down wind of them and not right in with them I saw that happen too a few times what a recipe for trouble, anyone else know of another good lake to kite on other than Millacs?
Tighe wrote:
WACONIA AND WHITE BEAR are intermediate or expert riders only. If you are not experienced do yourself a favor and go to Washington or Mille Lacs. If you cause problems and get these sites shutdown, you will have a very passionate group very pissed at you.
Since I don't kite in the water yet, I can't say I agree or disagree but many of you who started kiting in the early days did so right where you now say no beginners should be. You were also on equipment that you would probably now say is unsafe to use. I also suspect that many of you were out there figuring it out for yourselves with little more than a few tips or at best, a lesson during a vacation.
As a windsurfer, I have a pretty good sense of what to expect from other windsurfers and, since we share the wind, I know how to stay clear of kiters. There have been times when the kiter just makes it really tough to do. I can't imagine how boaters or swimmers who don't know what to expect feel like.
I do know that, hanging out at the Waconia launch, I have heard plenty of complaints about "those @$#%# windsurfers" (yes windsurfers) - fill up the access - come out of nowhere - just do what ever they want - etc. That's about windsurfers and we take up a tiny bit of the lake and our entire craft is in one place and a jump is a jump not a flight. I wasn't a bit surprised when they made half the lot trailer only and I wouldn't be a bit surprised to see it get worse. Windsurfers are passionate too.
This discussion pretty much parallels the quandries we faced when snowboarding appeared in the Midwest. The locals vs. grommies thing reminds me of the battles in the east coast surf.
My two cents:
Grommies (includes myself):
* Go to safer areas to get your skills dialed.
* Exercise some common sense and courtesy to bystanders and the more experienced riders.
Vets:
* Try not to shove the above down a grommie's throat...unless they're really asking for it.
I don’t know what to say about Waconia, because I have been down there during the week when there no boats or swimmers. But 90 percent of the time it’s not safe.
The other thing about Waconia is that the wind has to be almost perfect in order for it to be safe. This topic needs to be discussed more and then get a group of people together to implement any changes to the forum info or how we patrol the beach.
Slingshot Kiteboarding/Midwest Mountaineering Regional Team Rider
Even though I am a more experienced kiter, I have been trying to avoid WBL and Waconia on the weekends because there are just so many people. Having said that, this past weekend I did put in some time on WBL. I made I point to go early and to try to stay out away from the crowd while I was on the water. Once I was done I came in and self landed in a spot that was clear for more than a line's length in each direction. This formula can make for good times on the water in town during the peak summer months.
well I just wrote a very long response and my laptop just shut off...all gone. Damn.
I think this is a very good thread. It points to the severity of the issue, it points to the need for clear communication by all (here and at the lake) and that we as a community have to do our part or we all can loose our ability to ride.
I will work on the site. This issue just jumped to the top of the list. I like Tyson's idea and hope to have a draft up today.
I think many of the issues we are having isn't with the Lakawa Community. I think there are people buying kites online and thinking " can't be that hard, I'll just give er a go". This is where it is the responsibility of us all to very tactfully help, assist, educate, welcome, and save their ass, and our access. Tell them about Lakawa, tell them about Jason, tell them about S. Padre and Hatteras. Scare them a bit. There is no lake that is safe for these people.
It is also time for all of us experienced riders to lead by example. If I'm new to the sport, or just new to the area, and show up and see riders hucking huge amongst swimmers at Ramsey, I guess I'd figure it was ok. If I showed up and I saw kiters launch, and immediately ride up wind and stay up there, then only come downwind to get out, I'd assume that's how it was done. Almost all the major injuries here locally were to very experienced riders. What does that say?
As much as we are doing our best to get our database of students riding, I know there are large numbers who just want to do it on their own. They just don't see the value in a lesson. If we try to convince them it sounds like a sales job. We need your help.
The more I think about it, Lakawa's homepage needs to be a big disclaimer. I've tried to keep the text positive and as a result have made myself liable. I made the assumption that beginners were those who have taken lessons and are beginning riding. These new people, this is not the first incidence like this, are not beginners, they are just very uninformed.
Last edited by Tighe on Tue Aug 01, 2006 4:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Guys, come on,
It's the Jet Skiers we hate... remember???
Seriously, we all share a passion for the wind and the water (even the jet skiers). I was both kiting and windsurfing on Sunday at the Wac - the greatest group of guys and gals I've ever come across!
That story is scary - whoever did that probably bought their kite online (so didn't get a chance to be directed to lakawa and the incredible community of support we have here.
I keep thinking about what happened in Chicago, with the banning and the reopening with a PASA certification. Maybe it's inevitable. Maybe a simple sign at the launch would remind newbies that they could really hurt somebody...
I never said it was off limits but it should be so some one doesnt get hurt read my post i said it is NOT A BEGINEER SPOT LAKE WASHINGTON AND MILLACS ARE. and all i was tyring to say is that yes u made a good point go down wind of swimmers to launch.
You have a good point. All of us vets are lucky to be alive. The equipment sucked, there was no such thing as a quick release, and the kites were pretty much parachutes with one side cut off. We tried flying whereever we could, fields, Calhoun, and yes the launches we now say are for experienced riders only.
All I can say is we all had considerable winter experience with the inflatable kites before hitting the water and just cause us few didn't die doesn't mean it was safe. We were just extremely passionate ignorate dorks. With more and more riders entering the scene the chances of an accident just go up and up. Many of these newbees are learning about their kite and how to fly it at these launches. Learning to fly a kite, of any size, should only happen with at least 3 kite line lengths open downwind.
A 5 and 7 year old about 10 feet apart, then the kite crashes very hard, right in the middle of them. From where I was it looked as if someone got hurt bad. 
