I'm in the process of cutting out another cedar kiteboard. This time I'm going the whole nine yards and I am going to try and vacuum press it and use all stainless hardware.
It will be like 150 x 45 cm (59 x 17.7 inches). I'm going with a little more roundish shape to help in the chop.
I'm putting the footstrap holes like 7.5 inches apart. Does that seem about right? I check out one of the slingshot boards and that appears to be what they use.
I am measuring the stance between the strapholes on the topmost hole. I made it about 16.5 inches similar to the Lunacy. Another older board has a 13 inch stance inbetween. Any suggestions on that?
I offset the straps like 10 degrees. That was my ballpark guess to what that it would be.
The board thickness is going to be around .2 inches on the tips and tapering up to the middle where it will be like maybe .4. Not sure on that part yet.
Any tips or suggestions?
Cedar Kiteboard 2 - buildlog
Moderator: MK
Cedar Kiteboard 2 - buildlog
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Re: Cedar Kiteboard 2 - buildlog
Bryce
I am in no way a board builder or even feel I have much knowledge of how board shapes effect the ride. So take everything I say with a huge grain of salt. I am quite impressed. Diego and Geoff have made quite a few vacuum pressed boards and maybe will chime in with what they've learned.
One thing I notice about your board is the shape. You mentioned that you were softening the outline a bit to make it smoother in the water. I think though that you'll loose a lot of light wind performance since you're reduced your effective edge so much. It seems like most board shapes are now getting soft rides out of softer flex in the tip and tail of the board while still having a squarer shape. I was amaze at the soft feel of the new Misfit. I had tried them numerous times in the past and they were fairly aggressive in the water and less forgiving. The new shape, while still being squarer, gets its softness through tip flex. The board is also does amazingly well in light winds. A slightly bigger size might be the ultimate lightwind ticket. Just a suggestion.
Your board has the outline of the OR Mako, which gets rave reviews. They have a wide version that does quite well in light winds. I think the key to that design though is the significant concave to the bottom. Another thing you might consider.
my 2 cents and as I mentioned I really don't feel I know any of this stuff with much accuracy.
Can't wait to see what you come up with. I'm impressed by all the board building by locals. I've seen some impressive boards.
I am in no way a board builder or even feel I have much knowledge of how board shapes effect the ride. So take everything I say with a huge grain of salt. I am quite impressed. Diego and Geoff have made quite a few vacuum pressed boards and maybe will chime in with what they've learned.
One thing I notice about your board is the shape. You mentioned that you were softening the outline a bit to make it smoother in the water. I think though that you'll loose a lot of light wind performance since you're reduced your effective edge so much. It seems like most board shapes are now getting soft rides out of softer flex in the tip and tail of the board while still having a squarer shape. I was amaze at the soft feel of the new Misfit. I had tried them numerous times in the past and they were fairly aggressive in the water and less forgiving. The new shape, while still being squarer, gets its softness through tip flex. The board is also does amazingly well in light winds. A slightly bigger size might be the ultimate lightwind ticket. Just a suggestion.
Your board has the outline of the OR Mako, which gets rave reviews. They have a wide version that does quite well in light winds. I think the key to that design though is the significant concave to the bottom. Another thing you might consider.
my 2 cents and as I mentioned I really don't feel I know any of this stuff with much accuracy.
Can't wait to see what you come up with. I'm impressed by all the board building by locals. I've seen some impressive boards.
Tighe
Re: Cedar Kiteboard 2 - buildlog
To help in controlling the chop, I think that a flexier board would be more forgiving. A good compromise would be to have flexy tips and a more solid center. That way you can cut through the chop without feeling like you're standing on a piece of rubber. Using thinner tips and thicker core would do that.
The new Lunacy stance is wider to provide more stability for wakestyle tricks, so if your board is more a freeride one, I'd suggest narrowing it a bit. The angle of the foot straps doesn't need to be exact. You're going to move your feet around a bit anyway.
How well can you control the rocker and concave? A deeper rocker might be more important for chop control. A flatter board will plane earlier in low winds. I don't think that the concave shape would contribute much.
Since you're thinking about chop, I am assuming that this will be a medium wind or all-around board. The board might be a little on the big side, depending on the size of the rider.
Overall, it looks like a great board. Let me know when it's ready. I'd like to take it for a spin.
The new Lunacy stance is wider to provide more stability for wakestyle tricks, so if your board is more a freeride one, I'd suggest narrowing it a bit. The angle of the foot straps doesn't need to be exact. You're going to move your feet around a bit anyway.
How well can you control the rocker and concave? A deeper rocker might be more important for chop control. A flatter board will plane earlier in low winds. I don't think that the concave shape would contribute much.
Since you're thinking about chop, I am assuming that this will be a medium wind or all-around board. The board might be a little on the big side, depending on the size of the rider.
Overall, it looks like a great board. Let me know when it's ready. I'd like to take it for a spin.
(================P-</
Sponsored by Slingshot Kiteboarding
Sponsored by Slingshot Kiteboarding
Re: Cedar Kiteboard 2 - buildlog
Bryce,
As Tighe noted, the shape does resemble the Mako Wide series. I have the Mako Wide 140, which is very smooth in our choppy waters. I'm not sure how they smooth it out, but the board is pretty stiff (foam core), has a lot of rocker and deep concave. It's the most comfortable board I've owned (from many) and the most expensive!
Your are welcome to take it for a ride next time we're on the lake. I'm in Key West, FL this week but will be back on Pelican in a few weeks.
Mark
As Tighe noted, the shape does resemble the Mako Wide series. I have the Mako Wide 140, which is very smooth in our choppy waters. I'm not sure how they smooth it out, but the board is pretty stiff (foam core), has a lot of rocker and deep concave. It's the most comfortable board I've owned (from many) and the most expensive!
Your are welcome to take it for a ride next time we're on the lake. I'm in Key West, FL this week but will be back on Pelican in a few weeks.
Mark
Re: Cedar Kiteboard 2 - buildlog
Bryce
How much concave & rocker are you going for? With that shape & size and about a 30cm rocker I think it would be a great carving board in the surf or with less rocker good light winder. Also what do you lay on the top & bottom, 4oz, 6oz glass or carbon? I've found the different materials make a big change in how the ride feels on my cedar strippers. good luck & post pics!
Bryan Z
How much concave & rocker are you going for? With that shape & size and about a 30cm rocker I think it would be a great carving board in the surf or with less rocker good light winder. Also what do you lay on the top & bottom, 4oz, 6oz glass or carbon? I've found the different materials make a big change in how the ride feels on my cedar strippers. good luck & post pics!
Bryan Z
Re: Cedar Kiteboard 2 - buildlog
Thanks for all the tips!
I think I'm going to go for a mid-wind board that has a little better range then my 129 lunacy. I was just measured the blank I made up and it is only 60 by 16 inches... so I might have to shrink my design a bit. It will probably be like 145x39cm. So because of that I might harden up the edges and make it slightly more squareish... but definitely not to the point of the lunacy. So I can get a little better lightwind out of it. If this one works out OK I'll have to work on a true big lightweight one.
I'm probably not going to mess with concave on this one.
Bryan, I'm going to lay 4oz on the top and bottom. How do you usually do the rocker on your boards? I was thinking of putting some blocks on the ends of the board (after it is in the bag) and ratcheting the middle down to the table.
Denis, I'll probably bring in the footstraps a little more. Maybe like 15 inchs. I'll look at keeping the ends a little thinner to help with the flex.
I'll play around with it a bit more and put it up before I route it out.
I think I'm going to go for a mid-wind board that has a little better range then my 129 lunacy. I was just measured the blank I made up and it is only 60 by 16 inches... so I might have to shrink my design a bit. It will probably be like 145x39cm. So because of that I might harden up the edges and make it slightly more squareish... but definitely not to the point of the lunacy. So I can get a little better lightwind out of it. If this one works out OK I'll have to work on a true big lightweight one.
I'm probably not going to mess with concave on this one.
Bryan, I'm going to lay 4oz on the top and bottom. How do you usually do the rocker on your boards? I was thinking of putting some blocks on the ends of the board (after it is in the bag) and ratcheting the middle down to the table.
Denis, I'll probably bring in the footstraps a little more. Maybe like 15 inchs. I'll look at keeping the ends a little thinner to help with the flex.
I'll play around with it a bit more and put it up before I route it out.
Re: Cedar Kiteboard 2 - buildlog
Here is what I came up with
The black will be like ~.2 inches. The 1st white is the transition to the 2nd white which will be at like .4-.5 inches
The black will be like ~.2 inches. The 1st white is the transition to the 2nd white which will be at like .4-.5 inches
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Re: Cedar Kiteboard 2 - buildlog
Bryce,
The new specs/shape looks good for a mid-range board, I would even go shorter and a bit wider if anything, but not sure how big you are.
Don't know if you have the pads/straps yet but if you're using bolt-on straps, 7.5" seems too wide. I've used slingshot, dakine, north, and some generic pads and they go from 5.75 to 6.5" from the center of the bolt slots. Some brands give you as much as .5" to play but some are tight.
I agree with Denis, flexy tips, stiff between straps, helps in chop and I found that some concave helps to smooth the ride as well. I haven't use more than 2" of rocker and seems to work. if the board is going to be flexy at the tips, that would increase the rocker when you put pressure on them anyways.
As far as the bagging, I've used corcell foam and foam/pawlonia wood cores bagged to a rocker table (that you are welcome to use if you want to) bagging the bottom first and the top after the bottom cures. Good luck!
Diego
The new specs/shape looks good for a mid-range board, I would even go shorter and a bit wider if anything, but not sure how big you are.
Don't know if you have the pads/straps yet but if you're using bolt-on straps, 7.5" seems too wide. I've used slingshot, dakine, north, and some generic pads and they go from 5.75 to 6.5" from the center of the bolt slots. Some brands give you as much as .5" to play but some are tight.
I agree with Denis, flexy tips, stiff between straps, helps in chop and I found that some concave helps to smooth the ride as well. I haven't use more than 2" of rocker and seems to work. if the board is going to be flexy at the tips, that would increase the rocker when you put pressure on them anyways.
As far as the bagging, I've used corcell foam and foam/pawlonia wood cores bagged to a rocker table (that you are welcome to use if you want to) bagging the bottom first and the top after the bottom cures. Good luck!
Diego
Re: Cedar Kiteboard 2 - buildlog
Hey Bryce
Your med. wind board is looking cool. Just under 145 x 40 cm perfect for your size.
My 150 x 43s have been coming out with about 1.3'' rocker & .2 -.3 concave, 140 x 41 about 1.1" rocker.
Is the cedar board one solid piece now? If so you might try using four shims cut with a slight taper ( thick in middle thinner on both ends) to use cross ways with taller 2 at ends and shorter (thinner ) ones a third of the way in from the ends. you should be pull down a little concave in with the rocker this way?
spacing for pads has been six and a half inches between bolts except for wake bindings
and seems to work good on most all pads.
Hope this is helpful, if u want call me @ 218 428 5368, always ready to talk about cedar boards!
Bryan
Your med. wind board is looking cool. Just under 145 x 40 cm perfect for your size.
My 150 x 43s have been coming out with about 1.3'' rocker & .2 -.3 concave, 140 x 41 about 1.1" rocker.
Is the cedar board one solid piece now? If so you might try using four shims cut with a slight taper ( thick in middle thinner on both ends) to use cross ways with taller 2 at ends and shorter (thinner ) ones a third of the way in from the ends. you should be pull down a little concave in with the rocker this way?
spacing for pads has been six and a half inches between bolts except for wake bindings
and seems to work good on most all pads.
Hope this is helpful, if u want call me @ 218 428 5368, always ready to talk about cedar boards!
Bryan
Re: Cedar Kiteboard 2 - buildlog
And you might make the thicker part of the core extend to the ends of the board more, so just the tips are flexi.
Sqaurish will help with upwind and pop, but after riding the 132 Lunacy, I can tell that you gotta be heavy enough (or strong enough) to stomp on the corner when you are fully powered to make sure that it doesn't slip out on you. I found that I prefer a narrower tip for that reason.
footstraps: you gotta get the pair you are gonna use...amazing how you figure on a size and some slop and adjustment and then the pads only fit one way.
Sqaurish will help with upwind and pop, but after riding the 132 Lunacy, I can tell that you gotta be heavy enough (or strong enough) to stomp on the corner when you are fully powered to make sure that it doesn't slip out on you. I found that I prefer a narrower tip for that reason.
footstraps: you gotta get the pair you are gonna use...amazing how you figure on a size and some slop and adjustment and then the pads only fit one way.