Frenzy vs Manta, looking for pros and cons

[UpNorth]

Hey all you snowkiters, I have an opportunity to purchase an '09 manta II 10M; I currently own an '09 Frenzy 11M. I'm looking for a comparison between these kites. I've never flown a manta. I like most things about the Frenzy, but find it rather slow turning, otherwise Im pretty happy with it. I know the Mantas fly and turn faster, so is there an advantage to them vs the Frenzy? Powerwise, Im guessing they would be very similiar.

Any feedback would be great,

thanks
Jack

[jrjohnson1]

Jack, I have a '09 8 meter Manta and I own a few Frenzys. The the '09 Manta is a really fun kite to fly because you can do big lofty jumps with them, more so than the Frenzy. But because the Manta is a higher aspect ratio kite, it isn't as stable as the Frenzy meaning it doesn't handle the gusts and lulls as well. It's a Mille Lacs kite versus a Lake Calhoun kite. In '09 they came in sizes 8, 10, 12, and 15. The rumor was the 8 & 10 meter ones were the best of the 4 sizes.

[steveb]

The stability of the two kites is identical, they basically have the same bridle. The Manta is higher aspect so it turns a little slower, hunts a little more at the edge of the window, flies a little faster.
The frenzy turns a little faster , sits a little further back in the window, is a little slower for straight line speed.
Jumps the Manta is bow like and the Frenzy is more hybrid, so the Manta has more glide, the Frenzy has more pop.
You can't go wrong with either kite.

[UpNorth]

Ok, this is getting a bit confusing. I was always led to believe that the Frenzy was the slower turning of the two kites, and that the Manta would be less stable, more likely to bowtie or do weird things in gusty conditions. I also figured that the Manta would have more pop and lift since it is faster and could be redirected quicker. I really can't compare the two to bows and hybrids, because i dont kite on water (yet) so I that analogy doesn't really help me. Anyone else who's flown them both wanna comment??

thanks,
Jack

[steveb]

Both kites have what is called the X bridle , this is designed to stop bow ties, or if you do get one make it easy to pull out.
The Manta is a high aspect kite, it is longer and narrower size to size than the Frenzy . The Frenzy is wider and shorter from tip to tip so if you think about it it's logical the Frenzy turns faster. As far as jumping the Frenzy is more up and down and the Manta is more up, glide, down. I typically get more height with Frenzy jumps but more time in the air with the Manta.
I wouldn't sweat it as both kites are excellant and both kites can do just about everything so you can't really go wrong.

[seamonkey]

I'm wondering how much wind is needed to keep the new Manta 15 in the air? Would the overlap between the 12 & 15 be substantial? for climbing terrain I think the difference would be obvious enough.

[steveb]

All I can say, not having flown this years, yet. Is previous models would be in the air pretty much before anything else of a similar size ( kites used for lightwind ). The kite powers up quickly and for bigger people has a good top end. I've been very comfortable around 18mph, 20 it gets a bit of a hand full.

[UpNorth]

Ok, regarding light wind performance, would either kite (frenzy vs manta) have an advantage over the other, given similar sizes? I'm still talking about the '10 models or older, since there doesn't seem to be a lot of people who've used the new ones yet.