The meaning of expert rider.

[scottman]

Quick question to all of you riders who have been doing this for some time now, what really is an expert rider now days? Is it someone who can do every trick in the book or is it someone who can handle there kite in any situation that doesn't pull back roll with a kite loop 20 ft in the air? I think my definition of an expert rider would be someone who can ride in any condition, can tune there kite for max performance, knows when to get out of the water and where to ride and where not to ride and someone who has the basics down to the point of not even having to think what they are going to do next it just happens and happens real smooth. Someone who can pull a kiteloop if they wanted to or back rolls or front rolls, stuff like that but chooses to ride some swell or waves? I think we have a lot of experts out there that have these abilities and more, so what is really and expert rider anyway?

[JRN]

FIRST, get a bicycle, take off the seat, find an iron fence...right Patrick? I guess I feel confident that I can ride in most conditions, but I like the challenge aspect. Even though I can barely pull off any trick moves, I'm always sure there is another thing to learn, & no chance of getting bored or complacent. No matter how advanced you get, whether you're a schlub like me, or an ace like Naish, Dimitri, or Lenten,there are always new moves to learn, invent or perfect....I just know "expert" is something we all strive to become.

[steveb]

X = unknown quantity.
spert ( spirt) a jet of water under preassure.

I think if there has to be definition it's when someone can kite without being a hazard to themselves or others, they would be capable of self rescue and self landing. They were aware of the dangers of the sport and would avoid unsafe sitiuations.They would react quickly to potential kitemare situations solving the problem before it gets out of hand. They would recognize a potential problem before it becomes one.

I think expert has nothing to do with tricks, especially as I often see the most accomplished tricksters doing the most unsafe things.

[JRN]

I hate to admit when our favorite "Wanker" is right, a rarity for most Aussies, but safety & consideration for others should be the ultimate criteria. I will confess that watching others like Alex, Lenten & Dimitri do the insane, death defying stunts still gives me a big thrill. I am envious that you got to see D.M. perform those long distance boosts in person, Steve. I hope someone got it on video.

[steveb]

I managed to get some photos but no video. I'll get them posted when I have my feet back under the table.
Lot's to do catching up with the wanking undone while I was away.

[wings]

I usually think of kiters in terms of four levels: newbie, intermediate, advanced, expert.

The intermediate is someone who is generally self-sufficent but may need still need assistance with new scenarios of wind, location, equipment, etc.

An advanced rider is someone capable of tuning their equipment, scouting new spots, completely self-sufficient, and can handle and prevent kitemares.

An expert is someone who is advanced but also can do tricks in all/most of the styles of kiting. These are the pros. I'd argue that doing advanced tricks requires an elite understanding of the physics of kiting that most advanced riders will never be able to do. And lots and lots of practice. And a young body.
Its kinda like calling a Ph.D., Doctor, in recognition of their hard work and practice.

And, yes, I agree that advanced/expert level riders tend to get a little too comfortable and pull some cocky, dangerous stuff. Think Dimitri and the house:

http://www.clipupload.com/clip/showphot ... oto/14760/

Ok, where is the wind?

[Randy]

Scott, thanks for getting this thread going. It relates somewhat to Tighe's earlier thread of "Why we ride". Levels of performance have intrigued me ever since Abraham Maslow started writing about peak performance. George Leonard and Michael Murphy have written extensively about it from an akido and a golf perspective. Dan Millman's done some great work in this area from a gymnastics perspective, I worked with a guy from Colorado on his book about performance levels, Brian Davis. The common thread that comes back to me is "deeper performance". I think a delineation of "master" vs. "expert" vs. "advanced" can be helpful.
Just Be It has conducted several interviews over the years with expert boardsport athletes. Almost universally, they acknowledge taking small, incremental steps to any new move. There's also the use of imagery and vision, but it goes much beyond this. Imagine being able to bow shoot a bulls eye at 100' with close to 100% accuracy. The expert/master will have started shooting at a few feet, under the guidance of another master, slowly moving to greater distance. Small, incremental steps are recognized, disciplined form contributing to impeccable execution, and yet, when it comes to the next step (new maneuver, that point just beyond one's ability), there's a stepping out side of our usual notions of time and space. The rider has completed the maneuver 'before' it's initiated. It's more than positive image/vision and approaches a spiritual moment of faith that brings the rider to a feeling of gratitude for the maneuver's completion 'before it's done'. In effect, there is no room for 'missing the mark', a common definition in Christianity for 'sin'. Doubt is not possible.

Anyway, in hang gliding we had observer ratings like novice, intermediate, advanced and expert as defined by the community. It determined where and in what conditions we could fly and certainly helped us hold a very high safety standard. Most of the kiting sites in the metro area frequently require advanced riding skill. The Minnesota community has done an excellent job of referring beginners, novice and intermediates to Mille Lacs or South Padre and a few other local spots that allow for the learning errors without moderate to high risk of injury to self or others.

I've been involved in extreme sports since 1974. I've seen a lot of experts never making it to master. Expert snowboarders thought they could jump a sixty foot cliff after successfully landing a thirty foot cliff. Pilots who flew with great competence in consistent sea breeze crashed and burned with their first mountain flights, and the list can go on and on. Experts survive to become masters by taking small, disciplined steps, forever pushing the level of ability, forever in regard to the stewardship of their own bodies and those around them. There riding deepens with each ride moment living within them, giving the master rider very distinctive style that simply can't be replicated but is always recognized by others. B.B. King can hit one note on Lucille and we all recognize it as him. For over half a century he played over 300 days a year. Each moment he hit that note, it was new, yet each and every note he'd hit over those past years still lived in the arising new moment, giving it a depth, resonance, and style that simply can't be duplicated. Robby Naish carries this for us in windsurfing. You know the kiters. Bjorn Dunkerbeck sailed several hours every day, forever going deeper in performance to become a world master of our sport.

Experts and masters never miss the mark. Both have no choice but to deepen the ride. Masters just keep on going, knowing there's no choice but to go deeper. (why we ride? because the heart demands it). Experts may not survive (job, relational demands, failure to take small steps, etc.). The master dissipates energy and eventually sheds the body, yet forever carries a unique style that lives beyond the last breath. I've been so privileged to have been in the presence of a few of these from the musical venue (John Lee Hooker, Junior Wells, Stevie Ray Vaughn, Al Hirt, Miles Davis). Our ride sports carry these same giants and it's now tremendous joy to watch their style continue to deepen, forever pushing the window. And yes, there are masters in our midst, but they certainly would be pissed if we ever were so tempted to draw their egos to such a notion. It's just such a distraction from humility and focus that could contribute to the fatal 'missing the mark'.

Here I am writing this and I see the wind's come up. Maybe the better question is "Why am I not riding this moment?" I guess I've missed the mark. Anyway, I'm all over these kinds of explorations and would love to do some live group exploration with some fellow riders that are interested in this topic. I'd gladly host it at my spot in downtown St. Paul, so email me if you've got interest.