Kitesurfing Calhoun and City lakes(wack & wbl)

[steveb]

You can have all the discussions in the world , but I don't remember there being any elections for people to represent the kiting community.
Your conclusions will be mute because you have no authority to impose your wishes, and most certainly no defined support within the community.
We have been doing very well for a very long time using the various launches on the various lakes. If each individual accepts responsibility for safety , as has been the way for years, I'm sure we can maintain a status quo. Status Quo being the continuation of the self imposed bans on water kiting the downtown lakes.
For some reason some people seem to be trying to obtain some form of political position of authority in the community and I'm afraid that would be unacceptable to me and I'm sure many others.
If you see unsafe behaviour on the beach, take action and speak to the individuals involved...nicely. Educate, support and explain the dangers.
I think some people running an packs "representing" the kite community will do nothing but harm and potentially attract the the attention of people we should continue to avoid.
Be safe and have fun.

[scottman]

Well put Steve.

[Lee_Uptown]

I don't think the "elected" handful will be able to BAN or impose any rules upon any individual. I think I know this way better than any of you here because I can't get married, and very soon in Wisconsin I can't even see my significant other in the hospital! I agree with steve that we have been doing very well for a long time, however, this sport is growing exponentially, which increases the chances of having an incident. It's unrealistic to expect every kiter to be responsible, safe and smart... Talking to an individual with unsafe behaviour (hehe...) is a wonderful thing to do, and we should keep continuing to do that! However, it has a 50% probability of getting through the individuals head, and 25% chance of changing that behaviour. (I'm sure most of us are familiar with this about Calhoun's incidents). My guess is that the individual who's being talked to will most likely have a similar response about personal freedoms. Unfortunately, there's NOTHING we can do to change one's behavior and actions.
Based on the discussions and an educated guess: 1) I hypothesize that an association will be formed with some kind of legal BACKUP (NOT POWER), that is able to establish a rapport with the state authorities and organize fun events/encourage safe kiting practices . which benefits us and does no harm to anyone. For example, Nate organized a beach cleanup on Saturday and Barb, from the DNR (who lives down the road from Reddy), was there to witness it all. To state the obvious, that definitely gave us kiters a good image and I'm pretty sure Barb can vouch for us if there is a need. 2) IF, there were to be a serious incident involving kiters and the state gets involved, the kiting community will be more ready to do some damage control WITH an association rather than without. There's no need for an agreement or acceptance of an association and vice versa. I sincerely think it's going to be good group of people who will think through the issues and are prepared to deal with legal issues with lake access.
Through my eyes, I've seen a handful of individuals in the previous years who have been pushing for safety, an association etc. But to no avail, nothing solid has been setup. I do admire their energy and balls to hang their balls out there and it seems to get BB gunned down from lack of momentum and harsh criticisms. I can also see how quickly we can lose lake access, just one major incident + a few histrionic individuals with a lot of time and money on their hands could be it. Let's just be prepared I say.

Lets hug it out girls and bois. Positive energy...!

[jeff1]

just a thought to consider. This post began under the premise that not every minnesota kiter subscribes to this website? How are we reaching those that do not spend time checking out the "community" sites?

[JRN]

GOOD THOUGHT , JEFF. You must have had some time to ponder on your last shift at the old Duluth Fire Station. Maybe we suggest to all the instructors to inform their students, but you are right. There is still the nightmare scenario of someone buying obsolete gear off e-bay and heading to the nearest beach to try it out, and disaster results. We managed to "self regulate" enough yesterday at Ramsey. The crowds were sparse, thankfully, and I was encouaged to see kiters making friendly, but firm suggestions to the few who made "bonehead" moves. Keep it up guys!

[BBAddict]

I hear what everybody is saying and can appreciate all of the viewpoints. I understand not wanting anybody to tell me where I can and can't ride. I ride a lot of places that may not be the most kiter friendly, but can be ridden given enough skills and precautions. I also understand that some guidelines or bans or self-imposed rules may be necessary. I haven't kited that long, but I've seen major growth the last couple years. That is good and bad. Look how many teachers we have locally now that are all introducing new people to the sport at a growing pace. With over 100 people taking a Groupon lesson, imagine if half or even a quarter of those people show up at Malmo or Reddy to learn. Holy cluster-f$%k!! It is already a mess on good days. Good days that also often have a lot of swimmers. I think a lot of the logic used to justify the ban of Calhoun would be applicable to Reddy. What happens if a kite gets loose or a kiter gets out of control into the swimmers there? I think we need to be proactive rather than reactive. As somebody earlier in this post said, it is a question of when, not if something happens.
All of these opinions can be argued, but you can't argue with history. I never fully understood why I had to study history in school until a teacher explained that we study it so that we don't repeat the mistakes of those before us. If we look at a lot of areas around the US, we see a lot of associations or groups or clans or cults or whatever you want to call a body that makes guidelines/rules for the area kiters. Surely, we could learn something from talking to them before we find ourselves where others have trying to defend or get back rights to launch areas. Maybe we start with something that is not an association that is just people that care who want to educate ourselves and our community about how and what others have done so that we can make an informed decision...after we have a group hug like Eu Han suggested.

[rookie]

After hearing everyones concerns, Id like to propose to put together a group to work together to secure some launch sites for kiting. Especially so the newbies have a safe place to practice. NOT to regulate any rules! Just the gaining of some launch sites. The state had passed a bill to give the mountain bikers $125,000 to build some bike trails in the Crosby area. http://genny1.jimdo.com/imbas_tim_wegne ... biking.php http://cuyunalakestrail.org/index.cfm/pageid/40
I don’t think we would be asking allot! Kiting is a cool growing green sport, which I think will be supported easily. Especially with a bunch of passionate addicted wind junkies behind it!
Ride on,
Rookie ~

[Nathan B]

first group meeting is this thursday at Waconia. 6pm hope to see everyone there.

there were some good points made over the weekend, Bryce def made light of this whole post and I look forward to clearing it up. really appreciate those that came and talked with me about things over the weekend. lets preserve our sport!

[Tighe]

Can I ask a dumb question? Why are we having this at a remote location...again? For us working stiffs, driving out to Waconia through rush hour means leaving work early and sitting in near stand still traffic for over an hour, more for some coming from the East side. Instead of wasting all that fossil fuel, and everyone's valuable time, why can't we have this at a centrally located spot, maybe even one that has chairs, and make it available to a larger group?

Also I would like it if I am going to a promotional event to be told of such before I attend. Last weeks beach clean up had mixed agenda's. I'm fine with that if the intention is good, I just would prefer to know if there are commercial interests involved a head of time.

Nathan please schedule a meeting in Mpls or St. Paul at a real meeting spot, conference room, pavilion ( some nice new ones near Minnehaha Falls), etc.

[Tighe]

oops my bad. It is now clear to me that the reason the beach clean up's business connections were not mentioned in posts promoting the event were because of the Guidelines of Lakawa Chat, and not for any other reason. I understand the intent behind the guidelines and the intent behind the event. Not sure there would have been another way. The main thing to focus on is that the word got out, the event happened, one of our adored beaches was cleaned and we got in some great riding.

[MK]

Hoping I didn't skim past this or need to re-read the previous pages... There is a meeting this Thursday (tomorrow) 6pm at Waconia? I'll assume the DNR launch site but if there is common knowledge escaping me please help a brotha out. Thx.

[Lee_Uptown]

Oh man, Waconia at 6 pm can't be any worse for me. Getting off work at about 5-5.30 and then rush hour, it's impossible. I do agree with Tighe that we ought have it somewhere more convenient and proper for a good meeting. A spot we can sit, write/type and comfortable enough that we can think properly and make good decisions.

[johnz]

I just got off the phone with Nate - It's 11 am - and got him to switch the meeting to WBL, since it is a SE wind today.

We also bumped 'er back to 7 pm to give people more time to fight traffic.

I'll make another new post in an effort to get this as visible as possible.

Hopefully, the chance of some rides (for the more advanced riders) will help justify the gas...

7 pm at the picnic tables at Ramsey Beach.

[Nathan B]

Thanks John, seeing as no one is ever going to agree on anything. lets go blow some steam and shred some liquid and we will meet at the picnic tables at Ramsey and start a discussion and move forward from there.

Tighe not a dumb question at all, reason the meeting is at waconia is that this is the access that is most at jeopardy same with all all sites we need to physically be there and go over things. maybe a dumb statement saying u got lead to a promotional event as not once did I promote anything but beach and water awareness. I also made a separate post saying Memorial Weekend at Mille Lacs and a Beach Clean-Up with a Link to the Facebook page for the event made by Surfrider which is a NON-PROFIT who was supporting our clean up and awareness. please do not try make it into something its not as I was only doing a selfless act for our kite community and our beaches and waters.

these meetings are not to police or to take any form of political position of authority in our community it is to start educating the community and public correctly and properly. we do not want to loose access to kiting in the whole cities, I dont.

[MK]

If you haven't had a chance to see a summary of last nights meeting I've made it a sticky at the top of the chat topics: http://www.lakawa.com/lakawa-chat-f1/me ... 13587.html

Some of you may have set up alerts on this thread, like me, to get notices whenever a comment is made and I hope to help you stay up to speed with the developments.

[bmr]

http://www.youtube.com/embed/9fEjJ4Ecy9Q